E19: African Motherhood: Nigerian and Senegalese Parenting

Ever wondered about the cultural nuances of motherhood in different parts of the world? Curated for those with a keen interest in diverse parenting practices and traditions, this episode unveils the captivating journey of pregnancy and motherhood in Nigeria and Senegal. 

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

Hello, hello listeners, and welcome back to the Genema Podcast, where we talk about all things pregnancy, postpartum, motherhood, tips and tricks and more from a Senegalese-American perspective. I'm your host, isitugise, and today I have a very special, near and dear guest to me. I'm going to let her introduce herself in a minute, but today the topic is going to be a discussion on our experiences around Senegalese versus Nigerian pregnancy and motherhood. So we'll have a really in-depth discussion about that. But before we get into that, I want to give my guest, tywo, a chance to introduce herself to you guys. Hi Tywo, hi, hi everyone.

Speaker 2: 0:39

My name is Tywo. I'm super excited to be here. I've been watching all of the various episodes and I was so stoked when I opened it up. So, yeah, I hope you guys have fun listening to our experiences and hopefully we can do more of this.

Speaker 1: 0:56

Yeah, absolutely so. I'm just going to pull up my notes here on my phone so I can challenge you today with my Would you Rather? Game.

Speaker 2: 1:05

I hate this one, but you didn't give consent.

Speaker 1: 1:11

Would you rather, tywo, change your baby's diaper or deal with them while they're crying in the car? Change diaper, okay. Would you rather wrestle with them to give them food or try to get them into a car seat?

Speaker 2: 1:29

Wrestle.

Speaker 1: 1:30

You like to tussle? Would you rather give your baby a bath or deal with the diaper blowout? Oh, a bath for sure. Would you rather watch kids' cartoons all day or spend all day outside at the park?

Speaker 2: 1:51

Kids' cartoons all day, like now. We know all the songs, everything. So that and that.

Speaker 1: 1:58

I feel like I like the songs more than my baby now.

Speaker 2: 2:03

Like when I'm without the baby just singing, and I'm like what?

Speaker 1: 2:06

am I singing?

Speaker 2: 2:07

Like random baby cartoons.

Speaker 1: 2:11

I know, okay, would you rather? Let's see, let me give you a juicy one. Would you rather drink everything from a baby bottle or wear adult diapers for the rest of your life?

Speaker 2: 2:27

Drink from a baby bottle, for sure.

Speaker 1: 2:31

Okay, and then the last one would you rather have surprise triplets or a surprise baby at age 50?

Speaker 2: 2:40

A surprise baby triplets, that's three times the four. No surprise baby, please.

Speaker 1: 2:48

Okay, no problem. So I like to play that game with people, just to get the juices flowing. Make sure that you feel comfortable. So with that, we can get into the actual episode. Let me pull up my notes, all right. All right, before we get into the episode. Actually, I wanted to give a disclaimer that Tyra and I are not the spokespeople for Nigerian and Senegalese experiences. We're just going to be talking about our own experiences and giving our opinions, so take everything we say with a grain of salt. We also encourage everyone who is listening to reach out to us or just comment on the episode. Talk about your experiences. I think that's one thing about pregnancy and motherhood. It's a unique journey for everyone, so just wanted to put that out there. With that, I wanted to ask you in Nigerian culture, do people hide their pregnancies?

Speaker 2: 3:46

Yeah, that's a good one. So, yeah, people, most people hide their pregnancies. So people always tell the joke of when you don't see someone on social media for a while just probably means they're pregnant. If they're not posting anything, they're probably pregnant. So people hide it because of this. I don't know, like our parents, like, oh, don't let us do that. Nothing happens to your pregnancy. Keep it from bad, cool or funny things like that or just trying to protect what's sacred. Just keep it until you're sure you want to announce. But yeah, it's definitely a thing.

Speaker 1: 4:22

We have that too in our culture. So do you get to a point where you do announce it after you're further along, or you don't announce it at all, because in Senegalese culture you just pop up with a baby.

Speaker 2: 4:34

So it's two ways. Some people I think it's a thing of preference Some people announce it when they do the shoots and then they post their maternity shoots. Others, you just find out when they have a baby, or some post maternity shoots after they have the baby and then you're like oh you're.

Speaker 2: 4:50

So yeah, I think people it's half and half, but definitely no, I wouldn't say half and half, I would say 80% or like 70%. Announce when they already have the baby, and maybe there's some 30% that somewhere midway expecting a baby, yeah, yeah, I don't know that.

Speaker 1: 5:09

I know of anyone that announced it publicly. So like you might tell your close friends, but to announce it I don't think people are doing that, and we're starting to do maternity shoots in our culture, like those of us living abroad, even back home, in Senegal too. But even then they will wait until after the baby is born to post their maternity shoot pictures.

Speaker 2: 5:30

Oh right.

Speaker 1: 5:31

Nice, yeah, um. Are there any specific cultural practices that you know of um that you want to talk about when it comes to Nigerian pregnancy?

Speaker 2: 5:44

The pregnancy itself. Maybe like things that you're not allowed to eat which is sometimes so funny because it's not I don't know that it's backed by any science or anything like mothers just say some you know weird things. Or like things you're not allowed to do, Like a lot of them, I think, are dated, but like you hear things like don't go out with. Like, if you're pregnant, don't go out in the sun or something like that.

Speaker 2: 6:16

What happened? Like what do you guys mean? Like the sun, or like? I've heard one about safety, like pains, like so put pains in your like outfits if you're pregnant, just so that if there's any evil spirit attacking the pain, I'm like yo, yo, so like that's a ridiculous, things like that. But like um and like things to eat, yeah, but I think those are like the funny ones, like on cultural side, and so my about incentive.

Speaker 1: 6:54

you mentioned the bra thing because I remember when I was pregnant my mom gave me something that I was supposed to wear on my bra but the thing was so hard to attach to the bra. So I'm thinking if I have to change bra I have to go and remove it from the first bra and put it on the next one. God forbid I put it in the laundry. I'm not doing this. This is too much time. But I agree with you that there's just some things that it's more historical. I don't know that science has any backing to it. Like for your culture, if they say, don't go out during the sun, the sun is out all day.

Speaker 2: 7:27

Yeah. No, because I'm pregnant, I don't go out. No. Then the choices. Then they tell you, oh, and don't go out at night, because you know at night, no, I don't go out.

Speaker 1: 7:41

when the sun is hot, then when, when you go out, that actually segues into a question I have for you on like the work life balance, because you and I are both working moms. So how does that work then, when you have certain cultural limitations but you want to actually work? Are there stigmas around that in your culture?

Speaker 2: 8:08

No, not at all, I think in the past, if I think about my mom's experience, they had the flexibility of choosing not to work. So, they have people that help me, like the grandma and nannies, aunties. People are like they have so much help and they just stay home.

Speaker 2: 8:28

They don't have the husbands provide. But that's not an expectation per se. But if you want to do that that's being a working mom I think it's okay. As long as you can strike that balance of being there, I think it's where you start getting a lot of heat, like you let the baby and then you're just working, blah, blah. But if you strike the balance of somebody that's helped, like your mom, your husband's mom, like for nannies, just have some support and your support from time to time, that's fine.

Speaker 1: 9:09

Okay, the next question I have for you is what does the postpartum recovery period look like in Nigeria? So I'll give you an example. Like in Senegal, once you have the baby, you basically have to wear, you have to cover your body, because they say your body is open, so they will be rubbing shea butter on you, making sure you get the massages to close your body back up. I don't think you can just be out however you feel, especially with the baby. I think a lot of people wait like a month, two month, three months before they start leaving the house again. What does that look like in your culture?

Speaker 2: 9:44

Yeah, well, that one is quite dramatic too, like in Nigeria, but you have the baby. There's just so many things Like I remember I was just overwhelmed and I just saw my mom, my mother-in-law, like no, I don't want. Like just leave me alone. You guys Like I'm not sleeping Because you just come out from the hospital, you just had a baby. Oh, we need to massage your tummy, and you know, whatever, okay, cool, with hot water. You know you sit on the bowl with hot water, so that's all the bad blood comes out and I'm like okay, and then they start telling you they need to press your tummy every day. Or like, maybe hot water, towel, press, press. So you know, I'm like okay, and then after that they have to tie you. I don't know if you guys have to use like a cloth, like a black, like something really thick, like you know, and then tie around your tummy so that you like snap back.

Speaker 2: 10:45

And you have to wear that. So you know, there's the modern, the belts, like those postpartum belts that are like you know those eggs and they tell you, you know that one won't tie properly, it will not give you the due type. I think I did it for like, I don't think it was up to me, like three days and I'm like, I'm done, even the person, not anything. They're like. That's why we're here to. I'm like maybe this, you'll eat some things. They'll make you like all these vegetable drinks. You know all manner of things. You have to drink this Oops pop, which is kind of like a maze, like pudding, so to say, where you lactate. You know this. So you're just bombarded with everything left for center. If not, your meal could have come out. Go and drink pop. They'll make it in a jug, put it in your mouth, but it's not.

Speaker 1: 11:46

But yeah, we have something similar. It's called bruit. I've had pop before. Bruit is a different taste. It's more like sour, because pop, I think, is very smooth and you add the milk and everything, it ends up having a very sweet flavor. Bruit can be sweet too, but behind the sweetness is like a tanginess, and I think it's millet powder that they cook and it's supposed to help you with lactation as well, to make milk. The way they jam that down your throat.

Speaker 1: 12:19

Like I remember, after I had my baby and I came home I was so tired I just wanted to relax. But every two seconds my mom was handing me a bowl of bruit and she's like drink this. And you know there's a version of bruit where they put palm oil. Oh no, it's the most disgusting thing. I'm sorry to anyone who likes it, it was the most disgusting thing I've ever had. And they brought it to the hospital.

Speaker 1: 12:45

They say start drinking this now. So first time I just drank it because I'm thinking, okay, I'm supposed to do this, but then my gag reflex was not allowing me to enjoy it. So afterwards I had to just be like look, I know that this is something you think I should be doing, but I need an alternative, because I can't eat. It's raw palm oil that you're just drinking. Wow, yeah, it was disgusting. It's obviously the things that they make us do and like during that period, you would like the attention to be less invasive because you just went through a really invasive period. Like giving birth is very invasive. So now you come home and they add more things on top of it.

Speaker 2: 13:24

Yeah, I like the word invasive because I felt the same. I'm like it's. You know, sweet things happen. You just don't have control and then you come back and you just boom bad, a left right center. You're trying to get some rest but it's impossible and yeah sure.

Speaker 1: 13:42

I think something we have in common in our both our cultures is a naming ceremony, if I'm not mistaken. So what does that look like for you guys?

Speaker 2: 13:51

Yeah, so ours is after eight days. Eight days, yes, eight days, like I think in my culture eight days some cultures are a bit different, but I think eight days is kind of like an average, kind of like timeline. So after you have the baby, so before, because you can identify the name for the. So in the hospital is like baby, show me when my case, which is like my last name, and you have the baby, there's data. You then send the names to everyone, like everybody in your family, like your parents, your siblings, all give a name for the baby and then so when you come together name ceremony, call out all the names like everybody else you know, and most people call the baby by the name they gave the baby. So like if my father-in-law was wanted like address, like my daughter, he would use the name like he, you know, gave to her, like, oh, like she's Darra. But he'll say, oh, I was okay with me because that's like one of the names he gave.

Speaker 2: 14:47

And you just thought she's fine, you know, everybody kind of like wants it personal, like, oh, I have this, you know, whatever he's supposed to, just fine, he just has to remember the names. But, like your, you know one middle name, which is usually the name from the grandfather, like my father-in-law, that's usually the one that is adopted as the child's name. Okay, so the name from the parents, and then that one like on, like hard documents and all of that.

Speaker 1: 15:18

Okay, so okay, I want to make sure I understand. So, basically, everyone in the family that matters or like the close family that matters will pick a name and they will bring that to the naming ceremony. But then you have the parents. Do you pick from one of those or you pick your own first name?

Speaker 2: 15:35

Your own, you pick your own.

Speaker 1: 15:37

And then the grandfather. The name that they selected would be the middle name.

Speaker 2: 15:41

Yes, or in some cases the first name. But he might have like give me the name like is that one on matter?

Speaker 1: 15:48

Like yeah, so, oh wow. So are there ever instances where you might be talking to a family member, you forgot what name they picked and then they ask me about someone you're like who?

Speaker 2: 16:01

No, no, personally, yeah, but for them I play with people like they just call the child in the name, like the parents, like my mom does, but like some are so traditional, like they called the child and you have to like, oh, you have to address the child that way every time. And, yeah, sometimes when my father-in-law says because he gave about three names, so sometimes he interchanges, he can't call this one, like sometimes after I'll say, oh, she's fine, you know, because I remember that and it's just quite dramatic sometimes.

Speaker 1: 16:39

That's. I love it. At the same time it can be chaotic. I imagine me. I'm very forgetful. So you're gonna be talking about someone, I'm gonna who.

Speaker 1: 16:51

In our culture, the way we do it, it's seven days after. So the day that you give birth, when that day returns, that's when you have the naming ceremony and the way that we name. It's typically so at the time that you get married, they sometimes will assign like two women from your husband's side. So the first person will be from your husband's paternal side and the second person will be from your husband's maternal side, and those are called yikis. So I have two yikis who like down the line.

Speaker 1: 17:28

If I were to have baby girls, ideally I would name my baby like the first baby girl after the first yikis and the second baby girl after the second yikis. For men you can pick whatever. For baby boys you can pick whatever name you want, but for the girls that's usually how the tradition goes. But nowadays, especially outside of the continent, outside of the country, people are starting to kind of pick their own names and not strictly stick to that tradition and sometimes it doesn't even make sense. Like me, my name is Isatu. My first and second yikis both name Isatu, so I'm not naming my baby Isatu.

Speaker 2: 18:07

I said to her do all that and so forth.

Speaker 1: 18:11

So, yeah, it's one of those cultural practices that back in the day, was nice to kind of keep the family together. But as time goes, people are now like no, I'm going to do my own thing. Ok, now I'm going to start asking you more questions more geared towards motherhood. We talked about pregnancy a lot, but I wanted to ask you how was your motherhood experience as a new mom, when you initially became a mom, how was that experience for you?

Speaker 2: 18:39

I think it was great but definitely has challenges, like we all know. But it was very defining moment. It's like sometimes I'm just still taking it back, I'm still overwhelmed. I'm actually somebody's mother Like me. That's me Myself and push myself, for I'm like somebody's relying on me. Even if I don't get things done, I just have to push myself.

Speaker 2: 19:07

But the whole model experience, I think, for me I had help, like my mom and then my mother-in-law, so they really helped me feel like the first few months, just fresh from the hospital overnight to do the drill. Then I get to sleep in the mornings and then pick up the baby later. So I had support and I was asking a lot of questions Like I'm like hey, I'm clueless, what happens now? Like, oh, what kind of cereals did you use? Like, what kind of diapers? What kind of wipes? Oh, like medications. Like, do you use vitamin D supplements? Is it necessary?

Speaker 2: 19:45

Happens on the field. You take them to hospital immediately. Do you wait and see? Like I just always add so many questions Like I had this group chat with like two kids each and every time I come they'll say Ty, we'll question you Are you coming again, what's? I'll say yes. Now I'm like, yeah, that's all A lot of questions, yeah, but I think it got better. Like people used to say to me then that don't worry, it gets better. And I thought it was just like something cliche like here, right, but like it actually did get better Because you feel like now it would be more transparent, like cool to routine with, like you know, the baby, and then you get confidence like oh, I'm not thinking about you Done so yeah.

Speaker 1: 20:34

Good, I think, yeah, I had similar experience, but I was just googling away, Just yeah, I was like just on Google all the time and everything was something, something, something Senegal, something something something Islam. So I'm literally just trying to figure out all these different things and it was definitely like a roller coaster experience. I think it was nice that you had that community, like that group of friends that you could ask questions to. That always helps, and I have a friend who had a baby a couple months before me, so I really bothered her a lot. I sit his day. I still am like, hey, this is what she's doing. Did this happen for you too? She's like, yeah, yeah, you're fine. So that helps. What's one thing you would do differently if you could go back to those beginning days.

Speaker 2: 21:22

Not be myself up too much. I think I was just so paranoid If I did something wrong I'd feel so bad. Oh my god, like I forgot, like I didn't perform, and she's hungry now and I'll just be hysterical. I did exclusive breastfeeding for both my kids, like my first circumnavigation and but I think at some point that's the way for when I had my second and then I had to augment with supplements, with formula, and first I was very paranoid about it and I didn't use formula at all, like I just did breast milk the whole time. But back to your question. I would have done that differently Because then I was so critical, put myself under so much pressure, like you can imagine, if your mom is not lactating, maybe I didn't do whatever I needed to do and I wasn't lactating the next morning and I was always just stressed.

Speaker 2: 22:22

I used to be so stressed then Like everybody would be looking at me like where's the milk? You can't imagine that's so much pressure. I'm like, oh, it's not, it's just like 50. You know one on some time.

Speaker 1: 22:34

So why? Why all that?

Speaker 2: 22:35

madness Like it definitely put out all that noise, and not under so much pressure, because there's nothing to be fine, regardless of what option Formula breast, and just be less critical about everything. I think overall.

Speaker 1: 22:53

That's good feedback and I think I would tell myself the same thing. I also exclusively breastfeed and I remember in the beginning days when you're pregnant, they tell you about all these pumps and do this, and you store the milk, you build a stock, and I was like, yeah, I'm going to have a fridge full of milk and I was not lactating enough. At least I thought in my head. I wasn't. So one baby's stomachs are so small in the beginning anyways, you don't need a lot of milk. And then what I was doing was I was stressing myself out, trying to make more milk and because I was stressing, my body wasn't making milk.

Speaker 1: 23:33

Exactly here I was pumping, pumping, pumping and, like you said, I was just like, oh, that's 30 milliliters, this is so small. The next time I pump, it's even less. So I'm literally having on my phone. I had alarm clocks. Every two hours, every two hours, I'm pumping, pumping, pumping. And it wasn't until I stopped pumping and just press feed that it got a lot better and I was actually making more milk. But those early days I think that's good advice to be graceful to yourself and just take the time to allow your body to do what it's supposed to do versus trying to make it do, and it doesn't help when people are asking you too Like I don't know. My mom was like it's because you're not drinking your ruuy, it's because you're not doing it, it's not because I used to eat too many things.

Speaker 2: 24:17

I have oats. They say why don't you try the papa? I have papa. Oh the oats, biscuit, granola, like crazy, like a crazy person, literally Just eating water, doing everything just because I'm trying and it never comes until your treat just calmed down.

Speaker 1: 24:34

Exactly exactly Along the same lines. What is something that you want to do differently? Going forward as a mom?

Speaker 2: 24:46

I think it would be along the same lines of just like chilling out, you know, you know, like even with my husband, like when he is like trying to put the baby to sleep a different way than I could be able to sleep, sometimes he's like, no, don't do like that, like this, he won't sleep.

Speaker 2: 25:05

How are you putting him there? No, what, holding like this, be careful his neck, like now, like hey, do your turn and sleep. Like, yeah, like whatever you pull yourself out, you know. So I think, going forward as a mom, just like chill out, like it's, everything will be okay, fall in place, obviously, be intentional and like pay attention to like the details, like if they're sick, if they have acting wear or anything, but like when it comes like the dad, like let them do the other thing so that they also get comfortable with the child, whether you're there or not, because I feel like I was helicopter mom always yeah, like in, what are you doing? Oh, don't bump him like, I'm just gonna be like yo, do your thing. Like as long as it was okay, yeah that's it.

Speaker 1: 25:59

I'm getting flashbacks, too, because I do the same thing.

Speaker 2: 26:01

I'm like, no, no, let me do it eventually I find out that I won't, because I was always, like you know, chiming in and doing everything.

Speaker 1: 26:09

But like the second time I'm just like do your thing, and I found like that also helped him build his own confidence as like they're like, yeah, whatever, but before I was, you know, is trying to pee, play cooking you know whatever but yeah, for sure just do you think, like with the help that you get from aunties and mother-in-law and mom, that men have traditionally always been involved in raising the children, or do you think that's changing that now men are more involved than they used to be?

Speaker 2: 26:44

I think they're definitely more involved because if I think about like my mom's experience, like my mother-in-law, like just that generation they experience, I think like they have so much help, like when torn as babies, almost like you rally the troops like, oh, but so the father, they just, I think that they just their function is like the response basically just like to provide the money, what you guys need, everything like.

Speaker 2: 27:14

But come on, like put babies to sleep or bad the big like how, yeah, that's not his job in I feel like no, it's not, it's whose job? Like is it my job to also there for a while you're chilling? So, like some days, go where he was like oh, if you like it was into that. If you want to get your wife's attention, just um, what was it like? Just do nothing? Or like become just be watching TV, like just around me up, like hello, I'm confused while I'm here going crazy. So right now, I think definitely they're more involved than you know previously with the tradition thing that I make sure, like my husband is involved with things like help, support, just so that they don't also get comfortable or complacent like she's got it, you know her job, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 28:17

I think, yes, I'm similar situation. First, back home, you have help. You're not very rarely are you just by yourself when you have a baby. I think my experience living in the US has been one where, like, my mom came one month before I gave birth and she stayed one month after. After that she left and it was just me and my husband and the baby and I had to find that balance of how much do I do versus how much do I let him do. And I found recently that the more you, you know, give them the space to do what they need to do, they also build a bond with their kids.

Speaker 1: 28:49

I think I don't know if Nigerian culture is similar, but one thing I always talk about with my Senegalese friends is like the affection between, especially our dads. Sometimes it's not always there because it could be a disconnect in how we were brought up, that you know, nenny's raised us or our mom's raised us, and our fathers were more like just the providers. But like when I see like girl dad memes or girl dad posts on social media, I'm like, oh, that's so nice, I wish I had that with my dad. And that's not to say that the love is not there. I think it's just how the affection is shown, looks different, and I'm realizing now with my daughter and her dad, I'm like I want them to have that kind of relationship. So I have to take a step back and let him do his thing, like you said.

Speaker 2: 29:31

Yeah, yeah, no, I think definitely the same, like in Nigeria, with the culture as well is there's that tendency for the dust, just like Provide and do all of that if you don't, if you're not intentional about it up. Make that deliberate attempt to make sure they build up bond. But I think these were seen more of that like that's been involved wanting to bond with the kids from you know, from birth, and being part of the the story.

Speaker 1: 30:01

Yeah, yeah, absolutely Okay. Now the next part of the interview is a quick culture check. So we talked a lot about Nigerian culture, senegalese culture. I think there's a lot of overlap, so I wanted to ask you a couple of things and see we have that in our culture, and see if you guys do the same thing In Nigerian culture as well. Now in the US they call it doula, but back home is just like the woman in the village or, like you know, a woman who know about birth, now maybe your medical standpoint, but just because they've done it so many times, you guys have that as well.

Speaker 2: 30:35

Yes, we do we do.

Speaker 1: 30:37

Okay, we talked about the naming selection process. It's funny you brought that up because I had it on my notes here. But I'm very, very curious about your guys is naming selection? I need to know how many names are submitted during that naming ceremony. But Girl.

Speaker 2: 30:52

So everybody brings three names like so imagine if you have family of five I don't know if you have five siblings and then your parents, like your husband's parents and his siblings, so everybody's bringing three names. So we did the names and it's, like you know, a4 paper this person's name, this person, so during the ceremony, the master of ceremony, or whether it's leading the ceremony, when he gets To mention all the names of, like the baby, this that's. You know that, you know, until they get to like the one, the parents, and then the grand father, like my husband's, like paternal side, until they get to that final name when. But you know that, okay, those are like the names of baby will be like on print, like you know, yeah, meet the name of the son name. So it's a lot of names, for sure.

Speaker 1: 31:43

Yeah, yeah, that's. That's crazy. I hope I witnessed that one day. Um maternity shoot. We're now starting to do that more in Senegalese culture. I've seen definitely maternity shoots on the Nigerian side, so I think we have that in common. Um, do you guys have circumcision for baby boys? We do we do. And then you do ear piercings for baby girls yes, how soon.

Speaker 2: 32:10

I think the ear piercing is so, um, after they do like on this test, which is like a few days after your Hospital, make sure the child is clear. So we didn't like I think Johnny's whatever after eight days. So we didn't like a week, okay, yeah okay, yeah, I think they do. Pearson. What is it that the naming ceremony dirty? Have the person like the girls wow days or so, just like a day before the naming.

Speaker 1: 32:42

I remember I, my baby, got hers, I think at two months, just because the doctors here were, like you know, she has to wait till she gets certain shots. Then I went to the mall and this lady Um, she was white and she was like she already has her ears pierced and I was like girl, this is late, we're African, we're African.

Speaker 1: 33:00

She was like I was 16. I was like 16, yeah, yeah, that's so. That's interesting. Um, we, in our culture, we shave the baby's hair, the first hair. They will shave it at the naming ceremony. They say that it's it's unclean hair. Um, it's not mandatory and it's from a religious standpoint, but it is um, like, it's called sumna, which is a good thing to do, but if you don't do it, it's not like you don't get a point off if you don't do it. Do you guys do that?

Speaker 2: 33:31

I think it's the same. Some people do it, but, like you said, you don't get a point off if you don't do it like you want to.

Speaker 1: 33:38

And then the last one I have is putting your baby on your back. I think a lot of Africans do that.

Speaker 2: 33:44

Yeah, yeah, you tied the baby, yes, nice. So that way, what was your experience? Did you try the back and the front to compare, like what was easier?

Speaker 1: 33:59

Um, when I'm when I'm going out, I do the the front one just so I can keep an eye on her, but in the house, I'll just throw on my back, so my hands will be free. And all this will be free, too, for me to be doing what I need to do.

Speaker 1: 34:13

Yeah, yeah yeah, cool, well, thank you. That was, um. Those are all the questions that I had and I think this was, overall, just a really good discussion. Um, I want to thank you for making the time. It's been a while since we talked, so this is a really good way to catch up and just see what each other's up to. But I think also, our listeners will be able to Learn a lot from you. Know our different cultures. I think we talk about African Parenthood in such a way like social media. You know, when they talk about African parenthood like they're not playing games, but there's a human aspect to it. So I'm glad that we were able to talk and just talk about our experiences.

Speaker 2: 34:51

Any Thank you. Thanks so much for having me. I really enjoyed this. I was willing to go on and on, like you know, definitely any other topic, any other, you know, we can definitely jump on and chat, but thanks for.

Speaker 1: 35:07

No, of course. Definitely. We'll have to do a follow-up episode for sure. Well, thank you, tyo, and thank you to everyone for listening. I'll see you guys next time.

Speaker 2: 35:17

Bye, take care, bye.

Speaker 1: 35:19

Ciao.